Opened 9 years ago

Closed 8 years ago

#3644 closed defect (invalid)

Villages in Akita, Japan getting placed in incorrect region

Reported by: dpp Owned by: geocoding@…
Priority: minor Milestone:
Component: nominatim Version:
Keywords: Cc:


If I do a search for various towns and villages in Yurihonjo City, the search results find the correct locations but indicate that those locations are a part of the Ogachi region. They are not part of Ogachi, which is farther to the east.

Here are two searches showing the results as part of Ogachi. Countless other searches for places in the same area have the same problem.

Shows: 鳥海町 (Chokai), 雄勝郡 (Ogachi), 秋田県 (Akita), 日本

Shows: 本荘 (Honjo), 雄勝郡 (Ogachi), 秋田県 (Akita), 日本

In Akita, there are some locations specified by region (for example, places within Ogachi, like Ugo or Yuzawa), and there are some places where there is no region, or if there is nobody uses it (like Yurihonjo City, where the above search targets are located).

The above two searches should show something like the following:

For Chokai: 鳥海町 (Chokai), 由利本荘市 (Yurihonjo), 秋田県 (Akita), 日本

For Chokai: 鳥海町 (Chokai), 秋田県 (Akita), 日本

For Honjo: 本荘 (Honjo), 由利本荘市 (Yurihonjo), 秋田県 (Akita), 日本

For Honjo: 本荘 (Honjo), 秋田県 (Akita), 日本

Change History (5)

comment:1 Changed 9 years ago by dpp

I imagine that when the location is determined, the closest region waypoint is selected. The closest region waypoint is Ogachi, so it is automatically selected. If this is the case, it is probably an issue for all places in Japan where no region is specified. I believe that locations in Japan may be specified as follows: "village - town - city (sometimes doesn't exist) - region (sometimes doesn't exist) - prefecture".

comment:2 Changed 9 years ago by dpp

Also, prefecture is not universal. Could be any of 都, 道, 府, and 県.

comment:3 Changed 9 years ago by spod

If you click on the 'Details' link after doing the search, you will see that it is deciding that the place searched for is inside "Ogachi", which is a 'place=county' node. In the Japan tagging standards:

'place=county' is used to tag a District or Gun.

What follows are my guesses as to what is happening - I don't know anything about the internal details of how Nominatim works - but I have seen a similar address problem when searching for places in Kyushu in Japan!

The problem is almost certainly happening, because "Ogachi" is defined as a node, instead of an area, and is the nearest 'place=county' node to the node you are searching for.

Basically, there is an inconsistency with most of the OSM data for places, because most places are defined as nodes, but they should really be specified as areas. When Nominatim tries to build an address 'hierarchy' for a base-level place, it looks for parent-level places above the place. In this case it finds a 'place=county' node for Ogachi and, because it has no way of knowing the real area referred to by the node, it inserts it into the 'county' level of the address hierarchy. If it finds a number of 'place=county' places, then presumably it selects the one (in this case, Ogachi) that is nearest to the base-level place.

It could probably be solved by correctly redefining Ogachi to be an area instead of a node - then presumably Nominatim would not think that base-level places outside this area are in Ogachi.

As described so far, the problem is really because the data in OSM is not accurate - districts/guns should be defined as areas, not nodes, otherwise it is impossible to create a correct address hierarchy. The same problem can happen if 'place=city' are defined as nodes - Nominatim has to use the nearest 'place=city' to the base-level place, but obviously this might be incorrect for a particular address (the base-level place may be be nearer to another city node than it's real city). If the OSM data is relatively "complete", then the problem is reduced, but if the data is sparse, then the problem gets worse.

This leads to the possibility that there may actually be a problem in the way Nominatim works, that would need fixing for similar cases. For Japan, some places are inside guns, and some are not, so if Nominatim _always_ tries to insert the nearest 'place=county' into the addresses hierarchy, then that is incorrect, because many places do not have a district/gun in their address hierarchy, so Nominatim shouldn't try to insert one.

comment:4 Changed 9 years ago by Tom Hughes

Owner: changed from openstreetmap@… to geocoding@…

comment:5 Changed 8 years ago by Sarah Hoffmann

Resolution: invalid
Status: newclosed

spod's explanation is correct. The only fix for this issue is to define the guns, cities etc. as areas in OSM.

The problem of missing administrative levels is being addressed, see bug #4247.

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